Over the past 40 years, Leadership Austin has focused on bringing together diverse perspectives while also maintaining civil, productive discourse in our programs. When we thought about who could help us talk about what this practice looks like in action, we immediately knew which alumni could help share the story: Matt Mackowiak (Essential 38 – 2017), Chair of the Travis County Republican Party and Ed Espinoza (Essential 40 – 2019), Executive Director of Progress Texas.
Matt and Ed have established their careers working on opposite sides of the political divide. However, they consistently demonstrate the Leadership Austin core values of inclusiveness and collaborative decision-making by working together to debate and educate the public about the issues that impact all of us.
We recently sat down with Matt and Ed to talk about their Leadership Austin Essential experiences, and what it’s like to work with people on the other side of the aisle.
Ed Espinoza and Matt Mackowiak
Many who know you both know you from your political work and commentary on television, where you work on opposite sides of the aisle. However, as Leadership Austin alumni you both have mutual, shared values. Can you speak to your shared values and how you are alike?
Ed: Of course. Matt and I have many shared values. We care about our community and making sure we all have productive, civil discourse. Sure, we can mix it up about policy and certain big issues, but we should be discussing big issues. Matt and I are very partisan and we have been on the air together numerous times. We have been on air together when there was an active shooting, sadly, numerous times. On air, we address what is happening together and then we go back on the next day and we walk and talk through the issues and many times, even in difficult situations like that, we agree on important things. That is built on relationships. We have a shared value of relationships. It is so much more productive to have a relationship with someone you know and especially someone you respect, who you know is putting in as much time and energy as you are. We respect each other and support each other. We both know we are there for the right reasons. We will admit we don’t know about something and we are honest with each other.
Matt: When you get to know someone and where they are coming from and what they are like, it is hard to demonize them. You can disagree without being disagreeable. That is what we should be striving for. I have a professional respect for Ed. We both have put in time and our shared history and experience is something that I can easily get behind. I respect Ed’s view. So, it makes it easier to connect when we have to get across the table from each other. We have professional respect and we are friends.
How long have you known each other?
Together: Since February 2012.
What is your work background and how did you get to Austin?
Matt: I have 16 years in politics and government. I started right out of college in Washington, DC in the George W. Bush administration in homeland security. I worked at the White House, then left to work in the Senate. In 2009, I started my own firm and then came back to Texas. I have been working for the Republican Party and their candidates and doing corporate relations and corporate consulting ever since.
Ed: I started after college with the Clinton reelect campaign in 1996. I went back and forth between the California Democratic Party and public relations firms – all good political operatives have a backup plan. And my back up plan was public relations. This way I knew what I was doing in even and odd years. I worked for the California State Senate Majority Leader for a number of years. After Arnold Schwarzenegger got elected, I went to Washington, DC. I lived there for seven years working on Democratic campaigns and with public relations firms. I worked the presidential races in 2004 and 2008. I was one of the youngest super delegates in 2004 and that took on importance in 2008. I got hired by the Democratic National Committee for the western states shortly after that election. I had the fewest number of states, but the largest land mass. Texas was one of my states and eight years later I was here. I got picked up by Progress Texas two years after I moved here.
I started doing broadcast back in 2000 when CNN was looking for folks to do commentary in the early morning hours on the East Coast and since I was in California, I was their guy. I was on and off again and in 2008 I was an undeclared superdelegate. When I went to the DNC I went off the air, and then when I left that job I got picked back up again – and that is when I met Matt. Shortly after I came to Progress Texas, Matt and I began giving analysis together for various news programs. KVUE wanted to develop a program for us to discuss politics. We have been doing KVUE and FOX 7 ever since.
What brought you to Leadership Austin?
Matt: I had heard a great deal from a friend of mine who graduated from Essential in 2016. He said I really needed to look into it. He was finishing his class and he encouraged me to explore it. What interested me was that fact I had begun to feel that I couldn’t make a difference on a local level. I thought of myself more as a state or national operative than I was a local one. Mainly because of the makeup of the city council and local politics, I wasn’t heavily involved in local politics. Essential gave me the opportunity to take a closer look at the city and the issues.
Building a network and having the alumni group was great incentive to join, however for me I thought it would be a real postgraduate study in local issues. Upfront, that was the most valuable aspect of the class for me. Of course, when you get there it is different than what you thought it would be. They build the classes into communities. You share things and connect in this “safe place” that is unique to Leadership Austin. You bare your heart to these people which is another value. You really get to know how people live, work and what they are doing.
You also gain a lot of value from the teaching and different approaches to leadership. But you have to make the effort. You should not have to learn about leadership and the community on your own and with Leadership Austin, you can do it in a community. I liked hearing from the community leaders, seeing how they speak to a group, how they weave in personal stories, etc. I can tell you the single most valuable thing to me was the realization that I had not ever connected the lack of transportation and infrastructure to the affordability crisis. And the fact that people can’t afford to live in our city and have to travel long distances is the single biggest issue facing our community.
Ed: Is that the same day we learned about population density?
Matt: Yes, the Built Environment Day.
Ed: That was the single most impactful day for me too, for the exact same reasons.
Matt: All of our problems seem to relate to that.
Ed: I took the class in 2019. I joined Leadership Austin because I was too burrowed in my bubble in the political world. Through Leadership Austin, I have made friends that are on the other side of the aisle. It helped me break out from those who were just in my community. I wanted to meet people who work in utilities and local healthcare and education. I needed to learn more about local government. Much like Matt, I did state and federal work. I had followed a few mayoral races, but local policy is bike lanes and building codes – not affordable healthcare and national defense, which was where I was spending my time. Leadership Austin allowed me to get granular in our community. It was really interesting. It allowed me to study something different. I got to look at something I was familiar with but with a different lens. I didn’t realize it was so locally-focused. My household was getting more involved in local work through my partner. And I could talk with her and learned with her. One thing that I will say is that I started class in a general election and then ended during a legislative session. That was hard. For those like Matt and me, I would think about what your schedule is going to be like the year you apply.
If you could give advice to the current cohort, what would you share?
Matt: Use the experience and the time you have to develop deep relationships – pour in now. Once you get out it is hard to get back together. Challenge yourself and test yourself. The value of the class is not to affirm what you already know and believe, it is to challenge yourself to open up and look at the other side. The class challenges you to become empathetic and to be understanding of how these issues affect you and the community, and what the opportunities are to support change. It is a tremendous opportunity. Seize it and fully invest.
Ed: Mine is similar. As people grow, it is hard to meet new people and to make new friends. We meet new people because of our job, but we tend to meet the same type of people – it’s very homogeneous. Leadership Austin is the place to introduce yourself to new and different people. One of the best walk-and-talks I had was with a classmate who was a dyed-in-the wool Republican, very conservative, and we had one of the best meetups. We talked about all kinds of things like trucks and Netflix shows. We met at the Royal Blue Grocery in the back and it looked like a podcast taping, just us, surrounded by wine and we just got to know each other. We have completely different lives – I live downtown, he lives in the suburbs; he has kids, I have none – very different, but it was great. Because of Leadership Austin, you will be invited to do very different things. Go! One of my classmates invited the class to a dance party and that experience was incredible, made more so because I knew the guy on stage and we acknowledged each other and it had an impact. Embrace those who are not like you.
Final Thoughts?
Ed: I love that Leadership Austin goes to every part of the city. You visit different parts of the city and you have classmates from different parts of the city.
Matt: Keep bringing new and different voices and add different ideological diversity in the mix. Keep ensuring that we have people from different parts of the city with different expertise in the conversation.
Ed: Matt and I work to illustrate public civil discourse. We always want to ask how we are helping viewers better understand a topic. We don’t like the idea of pundits. Pundits give opinion. We analyze and provide expertise. That is what Leadership Austin does. You provide expertise and give information. You provide the public a better way to engage in public issues.
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